The ZenRUN Podcast

In this episode of ZenRUN, I chat with Chris Sarra about running, resilience, identity, family, and the powerful lessons that can come from simply putting one foot in front of the other.

Chris grew up in Bundaberg, in a big family, with rugby league, backyard sport, and plenty of stories from childhood. Running, however, was not always something he loved. In fact, Chris admits he used to hate running at school.

That changed later in life, when he began running to stay healthy and eventually found himself taking on half marathons, the New York Marathon, and now a total of nine marathons. Through his connection with Robert de Castella and the Indigenous Marathon Project, Chris discovered how deeply transformative marathon running can be - not just physically, but mentally and emotionally.

We talk about the first time Chris began to feel like a runner, why he started taking his running shoes on work trips, and why he believes you “can’t cheat a marathon.” Chris shares how training and finishing marathons helped him realise how mentally strong he could be, and how running at night under the stars became a space for thinking, reflecting, and doing some of his best inner work.

Chris also shares stories from his work in education, including his time as the first Aboriginal principal at Cherbourg State School, the importance of high expectations, and the belief that kids can be both strong in who they are and smart enough to thrive in the modern world.

There are beautiful reflections in this conversation about family too, including Chris’s Italian heritage, his marathon-running sister Venere, his son training for New York, and the way running can quietly model a healthy adulthood for your children.

Tips and Takeaways from Chris

• When running gets hard, bring it right back to the next step. One foot in front of the other.
• Respect the marathon. Chris says you can’t cheat it - if you try, it will find you.
• Make the time to train, even when life is busy. Chris trained for his first marathon while starting a major new work role and found a way to get it done.
• Running can give back more than it takes. Chris says running made him better in his work because it gave him space for meditation, reflection, and deep thinking.
• You don’t have to love every part of running to love what it gives you.
• Modelling healthy habits can matter more than lecturing about them.
• Running doesn’t create resilience from nothing - Chris believes it exposes the resilience that is already there.

Check out The Stronger Smarter Institute - https://strongersmarter.com.au/

Pass The Baton

Chris answered Kelli O’Neill’s question: “What’s your favourite aid station food?”

His answer? He doesn’t really have a favourite aid-station food. He tends not to eat much during marathons, doesn’t like gels, and prefers snakes or chewable chews. He did, however, remember the smell of roast beef and roast pork skewers during the Rome Marathon, and a magnificent post-race T-bone steak with red wine afterwards.

And Chris has left a brilliant question for my next guest - but you’ll need to listen to the episode to hear what it is.

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💛 Running used to clear your head. Now it’s another thing weighing on it. Let’s change that.

If you’re tired of dragging yourself out the door, feeling guilty when you don’t, or comparing every run to what you used to do—Feel Like a Runner Again is for you.

This practical program helps you quiet the mental noise, drop the pressure, and rediscover running as time for yourself.

Less “I should go for a run.” More “I’ve missed this.”

👉 https://www.zenrun.app/courses/feel-like-a-runner-again

---

🙏 A couple of big favours

1️⃣ If you enjoyed this episode, please follow, rate, and review the podcast - it helps more runners discover these conversations.

2️⃣ I’m always looking for runners to interview. If you (or someone you know) has a running story to share, I’d love to hear from you.

Find me on Facebook or Instagram @ZenRUN.club
or email hello@zenrun.club

---

🎧 Don’t miss an episode
Subscribe to the ZenRUN Podcast in your favourite podcast app so new conversations land straight in your ears.

Ben Pyman is back on the podcast and back at Delirious West in 2027, although this time he’s doubled the distance.

After completing the 100 miler twice, Ben has decided there was really only one logical next step. The 200. 😂

In this first catch-up for the Delirious West 2027 series, we go back to where Ben’s running started, how he became such a big part of the ultra-running community from both sides of the course, and why these ridiculously long events keep appealing to him.

We also get into how his training has changed this year, including the slightly alarming discovery that perhaps every run doesn’t need to be the same moderate effort for a couple of hours.

And then there’s the 200 itself.

Ben has some interesting ideas about how differently, or perhaps not so differently, he’ll approach it compared with the 100. He’s already suggested a few things that may come back to haunt him over the next six months. 😂

This is going to be a very interesting journey to follow.

Thinking about taking on Delirious West yourself?

If the stories in this series are giving you that little itch to be part of it, have a look at the event details and see whether 2027 might be your year.

Delirious WEST event website:
https://deliriouswest200miler.com.au/

Event Facebook group:
https://www.facebook.com/groups/1428304207182387

---

💛 Running used to clear your head. Now it’s another thing weighing on it. Let’s change that.

If you’re tired of dragging yourself out the door, feeling guilty when you don’t, or comparing every run to what you used to do - Feel Like a Runner Again is for you.

This practical program helps you quiet the mental noise, drop the pressure, and rediscover running as time for yourself.

Less “I should go for a run.” More “I’ve missed this.”

👉 https://www.zenrun.app/courses/feel-like-a-runner-again

---

🙏 A couple of big favours

1. If you enjoyed this episode, please follow, rate, and review the podcast - it helps more runners discover these conversations.
2. I’m always looking for runners to interview. If you (or someone you know) has a running story to share, I’d love to hear from you.

Find me on Facebook or Instagram @ZenRUN.club
or email hello@zenrun.club

---

🎧 Don’t miss an episode

Subscribe to the ZenRUN Podcast in your favourite podcast app so new conversations land straight in your ears.

John Herzfeld has already finished the Delirious W.E.S.T. 200 miler once.

Apparently that means the obvious thing to do is come back and do it again. 😂

In this first catch-up for the Delirious West 2027 series, we get to know John and the slightly unconventional path that eventually led him into ultra running.

Running hasn’t always been a carefully planned pursuit for John. In fact, his approach to training has occasionally been rather… minimal. Somehow, a strong mind, a love of long adventures and a willingness to keep plodding have taken him a very long way.

We chat about why running gives John a sense of freedom he doesn’t find anywhere else, what happened when a challenge that had kept him running week after week suddenly collided with real life, and why things look a little different heading into Delirious this time.

Because John has done something fairly radical.

He’s got himself a coach.

Whether he actually does what she tells him is another question entirely. 😂

There are just under 200 days to go, so this could be a very entertaining journey to follow.

Thinking about taking on Delirious West yourself?

If the stories in this series are giving you that little itch to be part of it, have a look at the event details and see whether 2027 might be your year.

Delirious WEST event website – https://deliriouswest200miler.com.au/

Event Facebook group – https://www.facebook.com/groups/1428304207182387

---

💛 Running used to clear your head. Now it’s another thing weighing on it. Let’s change that.

If you’re tired of dragging yourself out the door, feeling guilty when you don’t, or comparing every run to what you used to do, Feel Like a Runner Again is for you.

This practical program helps you quiet the mental noise, drop the pressure, and rediscover running as time for yourself.

Less “I should go for a run.” More “I’ve missed this.”

👉 https://www.zenrun.app/courses/feel-like-a-runner-again

---

🙏 A couple of big favours

1. If you enjoyed this episode, please follow, rate, and review the podcast. It helps more runners discover these conversations.
2. I’m always looking for runners to interview. If you, or someone you know, has a running story to share, I’d love to hear from you.

Find me on Facebook or Instagram @ZenRUN.club
or email hello@zenrun.club

---

🎧 Don’t miss an episode

Subscribe to the ZenRUN Podcast in your favourite podcast app so new conversations land straight in your ears.

Brad Halls reckons he’s more of a shuffler than a runner. Which feels slightly questionable when you’ve already finished the Delirious W.E.S.T. 100 miler and 200 miler. 😂

Brad only started running a few years ago, after swapping motorbikes for a pair of running shoes. Somewhere along the way, a rather fortunate 5K podium convinced him it might be time to retire from short-distance racing and start doing ridiculous long things instead.

Now he’s heading back to Delirious in 2027 for another crack at the 200, alongside his partner Kylie, with a pretty simple goal: have fun and enjoy the adventure.

We chat about why Delirious feels more like a very long party to Brad, the changes he’d like to make after this year’s race, and one rather questionable nutrition strategy involving pockets full of uneaten food.

There’s also the small matter of a possible gout problem, a blood test Brad really doesn’t want to have, and the fact that apparently running 200 miles is less frightening than a needle.

This should be a very entertaining journey to follow.

Thinking about taking on Delirious West yourself?

If the stories in this series are giving you that little itch to be part of it, have a look at the event details and see whether 2027 might be your year.

Delirious WEST event website – https://deliriouswest200miler.com.au/
Event Facebook group – https://www.facebook.com/groups/1428304207182387

---

💛 Running used to clear your head. Now it’s another thing weighing on it. Let’s change that.

If you’re tired of dragging yourself out the door, feeling guilty when you don’t, or comparing every run to what you used to do - Feel Like a Runner Again is for you.

This practical program helps you quiet the mental noise, drop the pressure, and rediscover running as time for yourself.

Less “I should go for a run.” More “I’ve missed this.”

👉 https://www.zenrun.app/courses/feel-like-a-runner-again

---

🙏 A couple of big favours

1. If you enjoyed this episode, please follow, rate, and review the podcast - it helps more runners discover these conversations.
2. I’m always looking for runners to interview. If you (or someone you know) has a running story to share, I’d love to hear from you.

Find me on Facebook or Instagram @ZenRUN.club
or email hello@zenrun.club

---

🎧 Don’t miss an episode

Subscribe to the ZenRUN Podcast in your favourite podcast app so new conversations land straight in your ears.

Levi Quinton has already experienced Delirious West from the other side.

In 2026, he was part of the race team, chasing runners around the course, watching their stories unfold and getting a very close look at just how much can happen over 200 miles.

Apparently that wasn’t enough. Now he wants to run it himself. 😂

In this first catch-up for the Delirious West 2027 series, we get to know Levi and the slightly unexpected path that brought him into ultra running.

There’s a back injury, a mum who helped spark the running idea, an unplanned marathon around the suburbs and a growing appreciation for trails that eventually led him into the Ultra Series world.

We also chat about what Levi learned from watching Delirious up close, why he’s not interested in simply piling on huge training mileage, and his plan to arrive at the start line feeling ready rather than completely cooked.

And before we even get to Delirious, Levi has another fairly ridiculous challenge on the calendar involving a Stairmaster and the height of Everest. Click here to find out more!

Plenty to follow with this one.

Thinking about taking on Delirious West yourself?

If the stories in this series are giving you that little itch to be part of it, have a look at the event details and see whether 2027 might be your year.

Delirious WEST event website:
https://deliriouswest200miler.com.au/

Event Facebook group:
https://www.facebook.com/groups/1428304207182387

---

💛 Running used to clear your head. Now it’s another thing weighing on it. Let’s change that.

If you’re tired of dragging yourself out the door, feeling guilty when you don’t, or comparing every run to what you used to do, Feel Like a Runner Again is for you.

This practical program helps you quiet the mental noise, drop the pressure, and rediscover running as time for yourself.

Less “I should go for a run.” More “I’ve missed this.”

👉 https://www.zenrun.app/courses/feel-like-a-runner-again

---

🙏 A couple of big favours

1. If you enjoyed this episode, please follow, rate, and review the podcast. It helps more runners discover these conversations.
2. I’m always looking for runners to interview. If you, or someone you know, has a running story to share, I’d love to hear from you.

Find me on Facebook or Instagram @ZenRUN.club
or email hello@zenrun.club

---

🎧 Don’t miss an episode

Subscribe to the ZenRUN Podcast in your favourite podcast app so new conversations land straight in your ears.

When was the last time you ran for five whole minutes without checking your watch?

This week’s ZenRUN Moment is a simple challenge that can feel surprisingly difficult. On your next run, leave your watch alone for the first five minutes. No checking your pace. No looking at your distance. No wondering whether you're running "well enough". Just run.

Instead of relying on the numbers, tune into your body. Notice your breathing. Feel your posture. Listen to your footsteps. Take in what's happening around you. Pay attention to your rhythm and how the effort feels. Your watch can tell you plenty of useful things, but it can't tell you how connected you feel to the run.

Technology is an amazing tool, but sometimes we hand over too much of our awareness to the screen on our wrist. Your body has been giving you feedback all along. The more you practise listening to it, the more confident and connected you'll become as a runner. You may even discover that running feels a little freer when you're not constantly waiting for the next piece of data.

On your next run, give yourself five minutes without looking at your watch. Trust your body, enjoy the experience, and see what you notice.

Small moments of awareness like this can completely change the way running feels.

---

💛 Running used to clear your head. Now it’s another thing weighing on it. Let’s change that.

If you’re tired of dragging yourself out the door, feeling guilty when you don’t, or comparing every run to what you used to do, Feel Like a Runner Again is for you.

This practical program helps you quiet the mental noise, drop the pressure, and rediscover running as time for yourself.

Less “I should go for a run.” More “I’ve missed this.”

👉 https://www.zenrun.app/courses/feel-like-a-runner-again

---

A couple of small favours

1️⃣ If you're enjoying the podcast, a quick follow, like, or review helps more runners discover it.

2️⃣ Got a running story - or know someone we should chat with? I'd love to hear from you.

Find me on Facebook or Instagram @ZenRUN.club

or email hello@zenrun.club

Craig Maluish has a bit of an all-or-nothing streak.

He wasn’t a runner growing up. Skateboarding was his thing, and running only really entered the picture during a pretty significant turning point in his life. His solution? Start with a few kilometres, attempt some enormous days on the Bibbulmun Track and sign up for an 80km ultra before he’d even run his first race. 😂

That probably tells you quite a lot about Craig.

In this first Delirious West 2027 catch-up, we chat about the rather unexpected path that brought him into ultra running, why the longer distances seem to suit him, and the challenge that involved running 50km a day for 11 days while still going to work.

Now he’s finally heading to a race that’s been on his list for years: the Delirious W.E.S.T. 200 miler.

And Craig isn’t simply planning to make his way from one end to the other. His competitive side already has some ideas about how he’d like to approach it.

This is going to be a very interesting journey to follow.

Thinking about taking on Delirious West yourself?

If the stories in this series are giving you that little itch to be part of it, have a look at the event details and see whether 2027 might be your year.

Delirious WEST event website:
https://deliriouswest200miler.com.au/

Event Facebook group:
https://www.facebook.com/groups/1428304207182387

---

💛 Running used to clear your head. Now it’s another thing weighing on it. Let’s change that.

If you’re tired of dragging yourself out the door, feeling guilty when you don’t, or comparing every run to what you used to do, Feel Like a Runner Again is for you.

This practical program helps you quiet the mental noise, drop the pressure, and rediscover running as time for yourself.

Less “I should go for a run.” More “I’ve missed this.”

👉 https://www.zenrun.app/courses/feel-like-a-runner-again

---

🙏 A couple of big favours

1. If you enjoyed this episode, please follow, rate, and review the podcast. It helps more runners discover these conversations.
2. I’m always looking for runners to interview. If you, or someone you know, has a running story to share, I’d love to hear from you.

Find me on Facebook or Instagram @ZenRUN.club
or email hello@zenrun.club

---

🎧 Don’t miss an episode

Subscribe to the ZenRUN Podcast in your favourite podcast app so new conversations land straight in your ears.

Ben Ridley once said he was never doing Delirious again.

So naturally, he’s signed up for the 200 miler in 2027. 😂

In this first catch-up of the Delirious West 2027 series, we go back to where Ben’s running started, which is quite a long way from 200-mile ultras. Running definitely wasn’t his thing growing up, and his first parkrun involved considerably more stopping and gasping than running.

Somehow, things escalated.

We chat about how he found the ultra community, his complicated history with Delirious and why, despite having some very good reasons not to return, he’s decided there might be another chapter left in this particular story.

And then there’s the Great Southern Beer Run.

Ben and a group of very experienced mates have come up with a slightly unusual way of tackling the 200 miler together. There is beer involved. Quite a lot of beer, actually. But as Ben explains, the idea behind it is less about the beer and much more about how they want to experience those five days together.

First though, Ben has a completely different challenge ahead of him: Melbourne Marathon.

This could be a very entertaining journey to follow.

Thinking about taking on Delirious West yourself?

If the stories in this series are giving you that little itch to be part of it, have a look at the event details and see whether 2027 might be your year.

Delirious WEST event website:
https://deliriouswest200miler.com.au/

Event Facebook group:
https://www.facebook.com/groups/1428304207182387

---

💛 Running used to clear your head. Now it’s another thing weighing on it. Let’s change that.

If you’re tired of dragging yourself out the door, feeling guilty when you don’t, or comparing every run to what you used to do, Feel Like a Runner Again is for you.

This practical program helps you quiet the mental noise, drop the pressure, and rediscover running as time for yourself.

Less “I should go for a run.” More “I’ve missed this.”

👉 https://www.zenrun.app/courses/feel-like-a-runner-again

---

🙏 A couple of big favours

1️⃣ If you enjoyed this episode, please follow, rate, and review the podcast - it helps more runners discover these conversations.

2️⃣ I’m always looking for runners to interview. If you, or someone you know, has a running story to share, I’d love to hear from you.

Find me on Facebook or Instagram @ZenRUN.club
or email hello@zenrun.club

---

🎧 Don’t miss an episode

Subscribe to the ZenRUN Podcast in your favourite podcast app so new conversations land straight in your ears.

Kelli O’Neill hated running at school.

These days, she’s a trail runner and ultra runner who has taken on everything from UTA 50 to Delirious 100 milers, with plenty of adventures, wrong turns and good stories along the way.

In this episode, we chat about how a women’s triathlon helped lead Kelli towards trail running, why being out in the bush and sharing adventures with friends became such a big part of her life, and how running has given her confidence that carries into life away from the trails.

Kelli also has a fascinating career in river health and ecology in Western Australia, and I loved hearing how often her work and trail running worlds overlap.

We also talk about staying motivated when you’d rather stay in bed, choosing events that suit the runner you are, and keeping some fun and adventure in your training.

A few of Kelli’s simple tips:

• Get your gear ready the night before and decide where you’re going to run.
• Make plans with someone else when you can.
• Give yourself something new or interesting to explore.
• Sometimes forget pace and distance and simply head out for an adventure run.

And of course, Kelli answers Alyssa Wilkinson’s Pass the Baton question before leaving one for my next guest.

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💛 Want to feel like a runner again?

If this conversation resonated, Feel Like a Runner Again is a simple, practical program designed to help you rediscover the joy of running. You’ll learn how to quiet the mental noise, let go of the pressure, and make running feel like your escape again, not another thing on your to-do list.

👉 https://www.zenrun.app/courses/feel-like-a-runner-again

---

🙏 A couple of big favours

1. If you enjoyed this episode, please follow, rate, and review the podcast - it helps more runners discover these conversations.
2. I’m always looking for runners to interview. If you (or someone you know) has a running story to share, I’d love to hear from you.

Find me on Facebook or Instagram @ZenRUN.club
or email hello@zenrun.club

---

🎧 Don’t miss an episode
Subscribe to the ZenRUN Podcast in your favourite podcast app so new conversations land straight in your ears.

Paul Watkins describes himself as having “close to zero sporting ability”, which makes the rest of his story rather entertaining.

Running started as the sport he could actually get into at school. Somehow, that eventually led to mountaineering expeditions, Arctic ultra marathons, dragging sleds through ridiculous conditions and, most recently, completing the Delirious W.E.S.T. 200 miler.

Paul came into Delirious this year wanting to experience the event rather than chase a result. He loved it so much that he’s coming back in 2027 with a slightly different question: now that he knows the course and knows he can finish it, what might he be able to do differently?

We chat about his fascination with doing hard things, why running became an escape from a life dominated by work, what those huge adventures have taught him about himself, and why sometimes the most useful lesson in an ultra is simply remembering that nothing lasts forever.

There’s also a rather excellent discussion about sleep strategy and Paul’s plans to become an “aggressive dirt napper” next time around. 😂

There’s a lot still to unfold between here and the start line.

Paul’s links:

• Website - https://www.paulwatkins.com.au/
• His Substack - https://paulwatkins.substack.com/
• Paul’s books - https://www.paulwatkins.com.au/books
• LinkedIn - https://www.linkedin.com/in/paul-watkins-92125499/
• Instagram - https://www.instagram.com/the.rogue.scholar/

Thinking about taking on Delirious West yourself?

If the stories in this series are giving you that little itch to be part of it, have a look at the event details and see whether 2027 might be your year.

• Delirious WEST event website – https://deliriouswest200miler.com.au/
• Event Facebook group – https://www.facebook.com/groups/1428304207182387

---

💛 Running used to clear your head. Now it’s another thing weighing on it. Let’s change that.

If you’re tired of dragging yourself out the door, feeling guilty when you don’t, or comparing every run to what you used to do - Feel Like a Runner Again is for you.

This practical program helps you quiet the mental noise, drop the pressure, and rediscover running as time for yourself.

Less “I should go for a run.” More “I’ve missed this.”

👉 https://www.zenrun.app/courses/feel-like-a-runner-again

---

🙏 A couple of big favours

1️⃣ If you enjoyed this episode, please follow, rate, and review the podcast - it helps more runners discover these conversations.

2️⃣ I’m always looking for runners to interview. If you (or someone you know) has a running story to share, I’d love to hear from you.

Find me on Facebook or Instagram @ZenRUN.club
or email hello@zenrun.club

---

🎧 Don’t miss an episode

Subscribe to the ZenRUN Podcast in your favourite podcast app so new conversations land straight in your ears.