The ZenRUN Podcast

In this episode of the ZenRUN Podcast, I chat with the wonderful Kat Cacavas.

Kat is a dietitian, health promotion officer, yoga teacher, marathon runner, charity founder, traveller and someone who has spent much of her life helping other people live healthier lives.

She grew up in Melbourne in a family where movement was simply part of everyday life. Running, dancing, swimming, surf lifesaving, athletics… if there was a sport going, chances are Kat gave it a go.

Although she loved running from a young age, dancing was her first love for many years. It wasn’t until her early twenties that running started taking centre stage, eventually leading her to marathons all over the world.

Including one of the most extraordinary first marathons I’ve ever heard.

Kat’s debut marathon wasn’t in Melbourne, Sydney or the Gold Coast.

It was in Sierra Leone.

That race became the beginning of something much bigger than simply running 42.2 kilometres.

Over the past decade, Kat has built an incredible connection with Sierra Leone through running, eventually founding the Make Ways Foundation, which now supports young people through movement, education and opportunity. What started with taking donated running shoes in her suitcase has grown into a registered charity, three shipping containers of sporting equipment, a community sports store and employment for local people.

It’s one of those stories that reminds you just how powerful running can be.

We also chat about Kat’s career as a dietitian and health promotion officer, why food doesn’t have to be complicated, how clever supermarket marketing influences our choices, and why chasing the latest fad diet rarely solves the real problem.

Kat also shares something deeply personal.

For the past three years she and her husband have been navigating IVF. She talks honestly about how fertility treatment has repeatedly interrupted her running, the emotional impact of constantly rebuilding fitness, and how she’s learned to rediscover the joy of simply running again whenever she gets the chance.

It’s a beautiful conversation about resilience, identity and remembering that running can look different in different seasons of life.

Along the way we also chat about:

• Growing up in Melbourne and discovering a love of running and dancing.
• Running half marathons through Paris and Nice while travelling.
• Completing her first marathon in the heat and humidity of Sierra Leone.
• Why running holidays are one of the best ways to explore a new place.
• Building strength after repeated ankle injuries… including one caused by stepping on a mango!
• Why runners shouldn’t underestimate yoga, breathing and mobility.
• How running has given Kat friendship, adventure, purpose and community.
• The original Athens Marathon and why it’s firmly on Kat’s bucket list.

Kat’s running tips

• Running doesn’t have to look the same in every season of life.
• Build your identity around more than just running.
• Running while travelling is one of the best ways to experience a new place.
• Don’t ignore your body when something doesn’t feel right.
• Yoga can improve strength, mobility, breathing and body awareness for runners.
• Sometimes the greatest running memories come from the people you meet, not the finish line.

Links mentioned in this episode

Make Ways Foundation:
https://makewaysfoundation.org/

Make Ways Foundation documentary trailer:
https://vimeo.com/1179061019/6127657463?share=copy&fl=cl&fe=ci

Kat’s online yoga for runners:
https://createdconnections.com.au/

Kat on Instagram:
https://www.instagram.com/katcacavas/

Kat on Facebook:
https://www.facebook.com/MakeWaysFoundation/

Kat on LinkedIn:
https://www.linkedin.com/in/katherine-cacavas/

---

💛 Want to feel like a runner again?

If this conversation resonated, Feel Like a Runner Again is a simple, practical program designed to help you rediscover the joy of running. You’ll learn how to quiet the mental noise, let go of the pressure, and make running feel like your escape again, not another thing on your to-do list.

👉 https://www.zenrun.app/courses/feel-like-a-runner-again

---

🙏 A couple of big favours

1️⃣ If you enjoyed this episode, please follow, rate, and review the podcast - it helps more runners discover these conversations.

2️⃣ I’m always looking for runners to interview. If you (or someone you know) has a running story to share, I’d love to hear from you.

Find me on Facebook or Instagram @ZenRUN.club
or email hello@zenrun.club

---

🎧 Don’t miss an episode

Subscribe to the ZenRUN Podcast in your favourite podcast app so new conversations land straight in your ears.

Every running step begins with one simple thing - your foot meeting the ground.

This week’s ZenRUN Moment is an invitation to become curious about that connection. As you head out on your next run, notice how your feet land. Are your footsteps light or heavy? Quick or flat? There’s no need to analyse or judge what you discover. Just pay attention to the conversation that’s happening between your body and the ground beneath you.

As your awareness grows, you might naturally begin to soften your landing. Not by trying to run with “perfect” technique, but by allowing your body to move a little more smoothly and efficiently. Many runners find that when they focus on landing a little lighter, their stride becomes more relaxed, their movement feels more fluid, and the run becomes more enjoyable.

The goal isn’t to become an elite runner overnight. It’s to become a more connected runner. Every run gives you thousands of opportunities to notice, adjust, and learn something new about how your body moves. Those small moments of awareness often lead to the biggest changes over time.

On your next run, let your feet be your guide. Listen to the conversation they’re having with the earth beneath you and enjoy discovering what they have to teach you.

Small moments of awareness like this can completely change the way running feels.

---

💛 Want your running (and your headspace) to feel a little lighter?

If you enjoyed this ZenRUN Moment, you might love The Running Reset - a simple bundle of guided runs and tools designed to help you clear your mind, reset your rhythm, and fall back in love with running.

👉 https://www.zenrun.app/courses/the-running-reset

---

A couple of small favours

1️⃣ If you’re enjoying the podcast, a quick follow, like, or review helps more runners discover it.

2️⃣ Got a running story - or know someone we should chat with? I’d love to hear from you.

Find me on Facebook or Instagram @ZenRUN.club

or email hello@zenrun.club

In this episode of the ZenRUN Podcast, I chat with Western Australian ultra runner David Martin.

David works in IT and finance, once spent his teenage years sailing yachts to Rottnest Island, accidentally became president of AURA, owns several running phones and has a collection of boxer shorts chosen by his children for different stages of his ultra races.

As you do.

David grew up in Fremantle in a multicultural family, with a Polish mum and Russian/Ukrainian family heritage on his dad’s side. He describes himself as much more academic than sporty, although he always enjoyed running, even when he was near the back of the school cross-country field.

His adult running journey began when a mate entered a team in the Busselton Half Ironman without actually having a team.

David agreed to run the half marathon leg, downloaded a sub-two-hour training plan and finished in 1:59:40.

Mission accomplished.

From there came half marathons, trail races and a growing curiosity about how far he could go.

But in 2020, everything changed.

After taking steroids for a medical condition, David developed severe damage in his hips. A surgeon told him his left hip was unsalvageable, his right hip was at risk and he would probably need a hip replacement within 18 months.

He was also told he would never run again.

David fainted in the surgeon’s office.

After spending several years away from running, he gradually began walking again. Walking felt too slow, so he tried running.

There was no pain.

He increased the distance, completed a 10km event, progressed to a half marathon and then decided to run almost every half marathon he could find in Western Australia.

Naturally, this eventually led him to the Feral Pig 50km.

From there, David’s running journey escalated rather quickly.

He jumped from 50km to the Delirious W.E.S.T. 100 miler, then completed Cape to Cape, Feral Pig and other major ultras before stepping up to the Delirious W.E.S.T. 200 miler.

David shares how he mentally approached the 200 miler by treating the first 100 miles as the journey to the start line of a race he already knew he could complete.

It worked.

Although there were some very dark moments, including briefly hoping a snake might bite him so he would have a legitimate reason to stop.

Later in the race, when he actually encountered snakes, his attitude had changed considerably.

“Don’t you dare.”

We talk about the strange mental places ultra running can take you, what it feels like to spend days alone on the trail and how David deliberately clears unfinished conversations, work problems and life admin before a race.

Instead of using the trail to solve problems, David tries to arrive with what he calls an “empty brain”.

He focuses on the scenery, wildlife, people and experience around him.

David rarely listens to anything while running because he wants to fully experience nature, although during the lowest points of Delirious he discovered that the right song could help change his mood and get him moving again.

We also chat about:

• Why David runs with a separate phone during races
• His fear of spiders and the discovery of “spider baseball”
• The importance of respecting the trail, wildlife and other runners
• Why his children choose his race outfits
• Kermit, Bluey, SpongeBob and shark boxer shorts
• Accidentally leaving two left socks at an aid station
• Blisters, swollen feet and losing six toenails
• His first trip to emergency after Delirious
• Why his physio believes strong muscles may help protect his damaged hips
• His dream of finding the limits of how far he can go
• The Bibbulmun Track and fastest known time ideas
• Why race entries help give his training a clear purpose
• The impact ultra training has on family life
• The pride, fear and support that comes from David’s wife and children
• Why he believes runners rarely achieve these things alone
• The community of volunteers, medics, physios, family and fellow runners who help us reach the finish line

David also shares plenty of practical lessons from his rapid rise through the ultra distances.

David’s Running Tips

Build gradually, even when the next challenge feels exciting

David used marathons, 50km events and looped ultras to test his body, equipment and nutrition before moving into longer distances.

Train on the terrain you will race on

Before his first marathon, David repeatedly drove an hour each way to practise on the actual course.

Use smaller events to test your systems

David used a looped 50-mile event to test shoes, nutrition, Tailwind and race equipment before attempting his first 100 miler.

Expect your feet to swell

David loosens his shoelaces later in races and plans shoe and sock changes around how his feet respond over long distances.

Strength work matters

After being told he would need a hip replacement, David built strength around his hips. His physio now believes that this additional muscular support may help him avoid surgery.

Deal with life before you reach the start line

David tries to resolve difficult conversations, emails and unfinished problems before racing so he can stay present rather than spending hours mentally stewing over something he cannot fix from the trail.

Let the event become your permission to disconnect

During long races, David removes work email, uses a separate phone and allows himself to be unreachable.

Respect the environment and the people around you

Carry the required safety equipment, look after other runners, respect wildlife and remember that the next person along the trail may be the one who helps you in an emergency.

Do not assume you have to do it alone

David credits fellow runners, race volunteers, family members, medics, his physio and the broader trail community with helping him reach the start and finish lines.

Carry toilet paper or wet wipes

This lesson may have been learned the hard way on a beach at 3am during Delirious.

David’s message is simple.

Do not assume that a huge running goal is impossible.

You may not know how you will reach it yet, but you can learn, build experience and find people who will help you along the way.

The Ultra Stats website:
https://statistik.d-u-v.org/

And make sure you stay until the end to hear David answer Kat Booth’s Pass the Baton question:

“What shoes, if you had to, would you chop up to make it to the end of your race? You might have to tape them, chop them up or cut open the toe box. Which pair would you do, and what would it take for you to decide to chop them up?”

You will also hear the question David has chosen for my next guest.

Let’s just say the Pass the Baton questions may be developing a slightly concerning toilet theme.

---

💛 Want to feel like a runner again?

If this conversation resonated, Feel Like a Runner Again is a simple, practical program designed to help you rediscover the joy of running. You’ll learn how to quiet the mental noise, let go of the pressure, and make running feel like your escape again, not another thing on your to-do list.

👉 https://www.zenrun.app/courses/feel-like-a-runner-again

---

🙏 A couple of big favours

1. If you enjoyed this episode, please follow, rate, and review the podcast. It helps more runners discover these conversations.
2. I’m always looking for runners to interview. If you, or someone you know, has a running story to share, I’d love to hear from you.

Find me on Facebook or Instagram at @ZenRUN.club
or email hello@zenrun.club

---

🎧 Don’t miss an episode

Subscribe to the ZenRUN Podcast in your favourite podcast app so new conversations land straight in your ears.

Running isn’t always quiet.

There’s the sound of your footsteps, your breathing, passing traffic, birds, people, and, of course, the constant chatter inside your own mind. It’s easy to think a peaceful run means complete silence, but this week’s ZenRUN Moment invites you to discover something different.

Today, listen for the quiet moments hidden within your run. They might only last a few seconds. The stillness after a car passes. The calm at the top of a hill. The moment the wind fades. The gentle rhythm of your breathing once you’ve settled into your stride. These little pockets of quiet are always there, we just don’t often notice them.

When you begin paying attention in this way, something shifts. Your run becomes less about the noise around you and more about the spaces between it. Those brief moments of calm can help quiet a busy mind and remind you that peace doesn’t have to mean complete silence. Sometimes it’s simply about noticing what’s already there.

On your next run, keep your ears open. Not just for the sounds around you, but for the quiet moments in between. You might discover they become some of your favourite parts of the run.

Small moments of awareness like this can completely change the way running feels.

---

💛 Want to feel like a runner again?

If this conversation resonated, Feel Like a Runner Again will help you get back to enjoying your running. It’s packed with practical tools and guided runs to help you quiet your mind, run with less pressure, and reconnect with the runner you already are.

👉 https://www.zenrun.app/courses/feel-like-a-runner-again

---

A couple of small favours

1. If you’re enjoying the podcast, a quick follow, like, or review helps more runners discover it.
2. Got a running story, or know someone we should chat with? I’d love to hear from you.

Find me on Facebook or Instagram @ZenRUN.club

or email hello@zenrun.club

In this episode of the ZenRUN Podcast, I chat with the wonderfully energetic, endlessly entertaining and slightly foot-obsessed Kat Booth.

If you have been anywhere near the Delirious W.E.S.T. events, you may already know Kat as the nurse who appears when your feet have stopped resembling feet.

She is the calm, capable and very funny person runners trust with their blisters, wounds, mysterious swelling, chafing, exhaustion, hallucinations and occasionally very questionable toes.

But there is so much more to Kat than feet.

Kat grew up in Western Australia and loved running and cross-country from an early age. Sprinting was never her thing, but give her about a kilometre to warm up and she was ready to keep going.

Her nursing career began with a slightly rocky start when she failed her first haematology exam and was promptly removed from nursing school.

Rather than giving up, Kat went away, worked in aged care, reapplied the following year and returned determined to prove she belonged there.

She worked her backside off, passed the same subject with an excellent result and went on to build a fascinating career across orthopaedics, plastics, skin grafting, wound care, education and health program management.

Along the way, Kat also somehow found herself running errands through Airtasker, chasing an escaped chicken down the street, delivering hundreds of plants, building furniture, creating grazing boards inspired by trails, finding a stranger’s passport hidden inside socks and helping her mum darn a collection of expensive flamingo socks for a very grateful burly bloke.

As you do.

Behind Kat’s humour and huge personality is also an extraordinary story of survival.

After experiencing serious violence in a relationship, Kat was left with an acquired traumatic brain injury. She had to relearn how to walk, write, speak and navigate everyday life. There is a period of around two years that she still cannot remember.

Her recovery involved jumbo pencils, repeating the same songs until she could find words again, artwork, ballroom dancing, handstands, walking enormous distances and slowly learning to trust her body and brain.

Running became an important part of that recovery.

After experiencing panic attacks and feeling afraid to return to the community, Kat began attending parkrun and later volunteered at a Light Horse event. There, she discovered Ultra Series, trail running and a community where she felt safe.

Naturally, after a major brain injury and problems with balance, Kat decided that running over rocks in the dark with a head torch sounded like an excellent idea.

And remarkably, it helped.

Trail running improved her balance, strength and confidence. It also reduced her parkrun time from around 33 minutes to approximately 27:30.

Kat eventually stepped onto the other side of the event herself at Light Horse, where she completed an incredible 62.7 kilometres without a watch, a distance goal or even a blister.

Unfortunately, a serious sesamoid injury and the return of foot-drop symptoms have now brought Kat’s running to an unexpected end.

She speaks honestly about the sadness of losing something that helped her so deeply, while also finding new ways to remain part of the trails she loves. Kat is now preparing to walk the 21-kilometre event at Tarawera with friends and is determined to keep moving, exploring and contributing to the running community.

We also talk about Kat’s incredible travels, including Oktoberfest, living in Whistler, meeting Kevin Costner, surfing in Bali, eating twice-daily gelato in Florence and being stalked by a cougar during her very first multi-day hike on Canada’s West Coast Trail.

And, of course, we hear some classic stories from her time as a Delirious medic, including sleep-deprived hallucinations, seriously battered feet and the memorable day a nearly 70-year-old runner tried caffeine for the first time during a 200-mile race.

This episode is funny, honest, moving and full of reminders that life does not always go to plan, but it can still be fascinating, adventurous and full of beautiful moments.

Kat's Tips for Runners

Kat encourages runners to occasionally leave the watch, pace goals and headphones behind.

Take your phone for safety, but allow yourself to run without worrying about distance, speed or what the session is supposed to achieve.

Listen to the birds, notice the trail and allow your body to tell you what it needs that day.

It does not have to be part of a training plan.

Sometimes, the best run is simply the one where you head outside, explore and have fun.

Kat also reminds us to appreciate the small moments. A city view from the trail, adding a rock to a cairn, leaving a tiny surprise for another runner or even successfully cooking the perfect soft-boiled egg can all become moments worth celebrating.

And if you are running a very long event, look after your feet early.

Do not wait until the blister, rubbing or swelling becomes a major problem before asking for help.

Pass the Baton

Kat answers Sally Pymer’s question:

What makes you smile the most on your runs?

Her answer includes birds, beautiful city views, rock piles and tiny fruit characters secretly left beside the trail to make other people smile.

Kat also leaves a very fitting question for the next ZenRUN Podcast guest.

You will need to listen to the episode to hear what it is.

This is a conversation about running, recovery, adventure, community, brains, feet, flamingo socks and making the most of your 4,000 weeks.

Enjoy!

---

💛 Want to feel like a runner again?

If this conversation resonated, Feel Like a Runner Again is a simple, practical program designed to help you rediscover the joy of running. You'll learn how to quiet the mental noise, let go of the pressure, and make running feel like your escape again, not another thing on your to-do list.

👉 https://www.zenrun.app/courses/feel-like-a-runner-again

---

🙏 A couple of big favours

1. If you enjoyed this episode, please follow, rate, and review the podcast. It helps more runners discover these conversations.
2. I'm always looking for runners to interview. If you (or someone you know) has a running story to share, I'd love to hear from you.

Find me on Facebook or Instagram @ZenRUN.club
or email hello@zenrun.club

---

🎧 Don't miss an episode

Subscribe to the ZenRUN Podcast in your favourite podcast app so new conversations land straight in your ears.

When was the last time you thought about what your arms were doing while you ran?

Most of us spend plenty of time thinking about our legs, our pace, or our breathing, but our arms quietly play an important role in helping us move efficiently. This week’s ZenRUN Moment is about bringing your attention to your upper body and simply noticing how your arms are moving.

As you head out on your next run, check in every now and then. Are your shoulders creeping up towards your ears? Are your arms swinging naturally, or are they crossing in front of your body? Do your hands and elbows feel relaxed, or are you holding more tension than you need? There’s nothing to fix or force - just notice what your body is doing.

Your arms help create rhythm and balance while you run. When they’re relaxed and moving naturally, your whole body often follows. Many runners find that softening their upper body makes their stride feel smoother, their breathing easier, and the effort feel just a little lighter.

On your next run, let your arms become part of your awareness. Relax them, let them swing naturally, and notice how they help carry you forward. Sometimes the smallest adjustments make the biggest difference.

Small moments of awareness like this can completely change the way running feels.

---

💛 Want your running (and your headspace) to feel a little lighter?

If you enjoyed this ZenRUN Moment, you might love The Running Reset - a simple bundle of guided runs and tools designed to help you clear your mind, reset your rhythm, and fall back in love with running.

👉 https://www.zenrun.app/courses/the-running-reset

---

A couple of small favours

1️⃣ If you’re enjoying the podcast, a quick follow, like, or review helps more runners discover it.

2️⃣ Got a running story - or know someone we should chat with? I’d love to hear from you.

Find me on Facebook or Instagram @ZenRUN.club

or email hello@zenrun.club

Today on the ZenRUN Podcast, I’m chatting with the wonderful Sally Pymer - runner, Ironman athlete, Comrades finisher, former fitness instructor, counsellor, speaker, farmer’s wife and strong believer in the power of a smile.

 

Sally grew up in regional Victoria in a family where learning, sport and community were all important.

 

As a young girl, she dreamed of playing AFL. Unfortunately, girls weren’t allowed to join the local team, and the football boots she desperately wanted for her ninth birthday didn’t arrive until her 40th.

 

Better late than never!

 

Running at school was a very different story.

 

Sally always tried hard, but struggled to keep up and was regularly placed in the slowest running heat. What nobody knew at the time was that Sally had chronic lung disease. It wasn’t discovered until she was 19, after a chest infection landed her in hospital.

 

Rather than allowing the diagnosis to stop her, Sally learned to focus on what her body could do.

 

She might not be the person you choose for a 100-metre sprint, but give her a long-distance event and she can keep going and going.

 

Sally’s running journey began when she entered a team triathlon through work. She was amazed that one of her teammates could run seven kilometres and decided she wanted to complete an entire triathlon herself.

 

She ran five kilometres once before her first event, finished third in her age group and immediately decided to do another one.

 

Naturally, things escalated.

 

After running around 15 kilometres, a friend suggested Sally should train for a marathon. Ten weeks later, she completed the 2001 Adelaide Marathon.

 

She went back the following year, took around 30 minutes off her time and eventually moved into Ironman events, ultramarathons and international races.

 

Sally has completed multiple Ironman events, competed at Half Ironman World Championships, run the Surf Coast Century and finished both the uphill and downhill versions of South Africa’s famous Comrades Marathon.

 

She also confirms that the downhill Comrades hurts more - especially when you discover you need to climb stairs to leave the stadium!

 

But Sally’s story isn’t simply about doing more and going further.

 

She speaks honestly about exercise addiction, burnout and the way running can sometimes shift from something healthy into a form of escape.

 

Through her work as an alcohol and other drug counsellor, Sally began noticing similarities between substance dependence and her own relationship with exercise.

 

Running released the feel-good chemicals, filled every spare moment and became part of her identity. Eventually, she found herself constantly training, eating, working or sleeping, with very little space left for anything else.

 

COVID forced Sally to slow down after several Ironman events were cancelled only weeks before race day. For the first time, she discovered what it felt like to sleep in occasionally and not be exhausted all the time.

 

Then, in January this year, a serious bike accident forced another major pause.

 

Sally hit a pothole, lost consciousness, broke both little fingers and fractured her back. She couldn’t run for three months and has also been navigating the lingering effects of concussion.

 

Her running currently looks very different.

 

She runs five to seven kilometres around once a week, walks regularly, strength trains and rides her mountain bike. Instead of fighting her body, she is learning to accept that this is a season of recovery.

 

We talk about running identity, injury, exercise withdrawal, comparison, smiling at strangers and why we are so much more than the things we do.

 

Sally also shares some beautiful reminders for runners:

 

• Focus on what your body can do, rather than what it can’t.
• Running doesn’t need to be fast to count.
• Stop comparing your pace or distance with other runners.
• Pay attention to whether running is supporting your life or helping you avoid it.
• When injury stops you running, find other enjoyable ways to move.
• Accept that your running will change through different seasons of life.
• Take in the sounds, smells and sights around you instead of always filling your ears.
• Smile while you run - it may lift your mood and brighten somebody else’s day too.
• Remember that you are much more than your job, sport or achievements.

 

Sally’s story is an honest reminder that success isn’t always about running further or faster.

 

Sometimes success is listening, slowing down and allowing running to become something that supports your life again.

 

And, of course, Sally answers Nancy Williams’ Pass the Baton question:

 

“What is the weirdest place that you’ve had to go to the toilet while you’re racing?”

 

Her answer involves 18,000 Comrades runners, an unofficial toilet and a car wash.

 

You’ll need to listen to hear exactly what happened!

 

Sally also leaves a lovely Pass the Baton question for my next guest - but you’ll need to listen to the episode to find out what she asks.

Sally links -

www.empoweredwithsally.com.au

https://www.linkedin.com/in/sally-pymer-6704ba68/

https://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=61558022105068

https://www.instagram.com/empowered_with_sally/

 

⸻

 

💛 Want to feel like a runner again?

 

If this conversation resonated, Feel Like a Runner Again is a simple, practical program designed to help you rediscover the joy of running. You’ll learn how to quiet the mental noise, let go of the pressure, and make running feel like your escape again, not another thing on your to-do list.

👉 https://www.zenrun.app/courses/feel-like-a-runner-again

 

⸻

 

🙏 A couple of big favours

 

1️⃣ If you enjoyed this episode, please follow, rate, and review the podcast - it helps more runners discover these conversations.

2️⃣ I’m always looking for runners to interview. If you (or someone you know) has a running story to share, I’d love to hear from you.

 

Find me on Facebook or Instagram @ZenRUN.club

or email hello@zenrun.club

 

⸻

 

🎧 Don’t miss an episode

Subscribe to the ZenRUN Podcast in your favourite podcast app so new conversations land straight in your ears.

How often do you head out the door and settle into your running pace almost immediately?

This week’s ZenRUN Moment is an invitation to do the opposite. On your next run, deliberately spend the first five minutes running slower than feels necessary. It might feel strange at first - maybe even a little frustrating - but stick with it. This isn’t about fitness or holding yourself back. It’s about giving your body the time it needs to settle into the run.

Starting gently allows your breathing to find its rhythm, your muscles to warm up naturally, and your nervous system to relax. Instead of launching into your run feeling rushed, you create space for your body to wake up gradually. Many runners discover they actually feel stronger and more comfortable later in the run because they resisted the urge to push too hard too soon.

There’s a lesson here that reaches beyond running too. We don’t have to sprint into everything we do. Sometimes the best results come from beginning with patience instead of urgency, allowing ourselves time to find our rhythm before asking for our best.

On your next run, give yourself permission to ease in. You might be surprised by how much more enjoyable the rest of your run feels when you start gently.

Small moments of awareness like this can completely change the way running feels.

---

💛 Want your running (and your headspace) to feel a little lighter?

If you enjoyed this ZenRUN Moment, you might love The Running Reset - a simple bundle of guided runs and tools designed to help you clear your mind, reset your rhythm, and fall back in love with running.

👉 https://www.zenrun.app/courses/the-running-reset

---

A couple of small favours

1️⃣ If you’re enjoying the podcast, a quick follow, like, or review helps more runners discover it.

2️⃣ Got a running story - or know someone we should chat with? I’d love to hear from you.

Find me on Facebook or Instagram @ZenRUN.club

or email hello@zenrun.club

Today on the ZenRUN Podcast, I’m chatting with my wonderful friend Nancy Williams.

Nancy is a runner, ultra runner, race director, event manager, single mum, serial degree collector, cross-stitch enthusiast and the calm-looking swan behind some seriously complicated running events.

Although, as Nancy explains, there is often a LOT of frantic paddling happening beneath the surface.

Nancy grew up in Adelaide in a highly academic family and describes herself as the girl who always felt different. School was difficult, running was something she actively avoided, and she became very skilled at finding reasons not to participate in cross-country.

So naturally, she went on to run marathons, 100 milers, backyard ultras and some of Australia’s toughest trail events.

Nancy openly shares the challenging parts of her journey, including bullying, an eating disorder as a teenager, difficult relationships, becoming a single parent, discovering she is neurodivergent later in life and the long process of learning to understand and accept herself.

Running became the constant throughout it all.

It gave Nancy freedom, connection, headspace, purpose and eventually an entirely new career.

After volunteering extensively with Ultra Series, Nancy stepped into race directing and discovered she was completely in her element. She now manages seven Ultra Series races, runs two events of her own and helps organise the 24 parkruns event.

We chat about the enormous amount of work that goes into making an event appear calm and organised, why Nancy wants every runner to feel valued, and why the person completing three backyard yards deserves just as much celebration as the runner completing 60.

Nancy also shares why being an athlete can be one of the rare times she allows somebody else to look after her.

Apparently, all you need to do is run 100 miles to have someone offer to fill your drink bottle and bring you food.

Seems perfectly reasonable.

We also talk about Nancy’s own running adventures, including:

• Running her first City to Bay after barely running outdoors
• Her first half marathon in England
• Running London, New York and Dublin marathons
• Completing 31 yards at a backyard ultra
• Finishing Irrational South 100 Miler
• Surviving an incredibly tough Delirious W.E.S.T. 100 Miler
• Her plans to return for the Delirious 200 Miler
• A rare and painful tendon injury that required surgery
• Why she needs a big race goal to keep her moving
• Her love of running with other people
• Why she still wants to run forever

Links to a few of Nancy's events: 

The Australian 6 day Event:- http//:australian6day.com.au

And

The Southern Cross 24 Hour Event:- http//:southerncross24hour.com.au

Nancy’s Running Tips

Find the goal that works for you

Nancy is strongly goal-driven. Having a race on the calendar gives her a reason to train, particularly when life becomes difficult or motivation disappears.

Your goal does not need to be anyone else’s idea of impressive. It simply needs to mean something to you.

Do not lose perspective

When we spend time around ultra runners, it is easy to begin thinking that a marathon, 50K or a handful of backyard yards is somehow “not far.”

Nancy reminds us that every runner’s achievement deserves to be celebrated.

Three yards can represent the biggest distance somebody has ever covered. That matters.

Learn from the imperfect races

Some of Nancy’s most valuable races were not the ones where everything went smoothly. Difficult experiences at Irrational South and Delirious taught her about her thinking, her decisions and her ability to keep moving when things felt impossible.

There is no perfect race, but every race can teach us something.

Work with people who understand runners

After a serious injury left Nancy unable to run or even walk comfortably, her physio gave her something incredibly important: a clear path forward and confidence that she would run again.

Finding a health professional who understands your goals can make a huge difference physically and emotionally.

Notice the runs where nothing hurts

Runners are very good at focusing on the sore tendon, painful toe or grumpy Achilles.

Nancy and I discuss the importance of noticing the moments when everything actually feels okay. When you finish a run feeling comfortable, pause and appreciate it.

Bring yourself back to this step

When Nancy begins thinking too far ahead during an ultra, she uses the mantra:

“Just this moment. Just this step.”

She combines it with noticing what she can see, hear, smell and feel. This helps calm the panic, quieten the mind and return her attention to what is happening right now.

Pass the Baton

Nancy answered Jos Middleton’s question:

“Have you got one particular ritual that you do as part of your running?”

Nancy shares the simple grounding mantra she uses during backyard ultras and difficult moments in long races.

Then, in keeping with the direction our conversation took within approximately two minutes of starting, Nancy passed on a rather entertaining toilet-related question for my next guest.

You will need to listen to the episode to hear exactly what she asked.

Listen to the Episode

Join us for an honest, funny and deeply relatable conversation about running, belonging, identity, big goals, imperfect races, event directing, cross-stitch and why runners apparently cannot avoid discussing toilets.

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💛 Want your running to feel lighter again?

If this conversation resonated, you might enjoy The Running Reset - a simple bundle of guided runs and practical tools to help you reset your rhythm, clear your head, and reconnect with why you run.

👉 Explore The Running Reset

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🙏 A couple of big favours

1. If you enjoyed this episode, please follow, rate, and review the podcast - it helps more runners discover these conversations.
2. I’m always looking for runners to interview. If you, or someone you know, has a running story to share, I’d love to hear from you.

Find me on Facebook or Instagram at @ZenRUN.club
or email hello@zenrun.club

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🎧 Don’t miss an episode

Subscribe to the ZenRUN Podcast in your favourite podcast app so new conversations land straight in your ears.

Have you ever noticed what your jaw is doing while you run?

It might sound like an odd thing to pay attention to, but it’s amazing how much tension we carry there without even realising it. This week’s ZenRUN Moment is all about one simple check-in: relaxing your jaw while you run.

As you’re heading along, pause for a moment and notice. Is your jaw clenched? Are your teeth pressed together? If they are, gently let them soften. You might even let your mouth hang open slightly for a second - it feels a bit funny, but it works! When your jaw relaxes, you’ll often notice a ripple effect through the rest of your body. Your shoulders drop, your breathing becomes easier, and your whole body starts to feel less tense.

Our bodies are incredibly connected. We often think we need to push harder or try more, but sometimes the biggest improvement comes from letting go instead. A small adjustment in one area can completely change how the rest of your body feels.

So on your next run, check in with your jaw every now and then. See what happens when you soften instead of tighten. You might discover that running feels lighter, calmer, and a whole lot more enjoyable.

Small moments of awareness like this can completely change the way running feels.

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💛 Want your running (and your headspace) to feel a little lighter?

If you enjoyed this ZenRUN Moment, you might love The Running Reset - a simple bundle of guided runs and tools designed to help you clear your mind, reset your rhythm, and fall back in love with running.

👉 https://www.zenrun.app/courses/the-running-reset

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A couple of small favours

1️⃣ If you’re enjoying the podcast, a quick follow, like, or review helps more runners discover it.

2️⃣ Got a running story - or know someone we should chat with? I’d love to hear from you.

Find me on Facebook or Instagram @ZenRUN.club

or email hello@zenrun.club